Eliminate Feedback Scoring

Timothy_Smith

Keep the feedback comments; eliminate feedback scoring.
Let the only numerical score be the order count- the system can award badges based on the number of orders a store receives. Fifty, 100, 512, 1138, or whatever levels seem appropriate. Feedback then remains as an optional comment on a transaction.

This immediately ends all debate and discussion about feedback levels and fairness.
And it's a chance to take this site in a different direction, away from the models used by other sites.

Loremonger

So something more like the 5-star system on Amazon?

theHellmouth

No a star system again refers to a feedback scoring.

I like the idea of just having a scoring based on number of orders. But I would advice to still include a ratio of negative over positive feedback. That way a big store getting a lot of orders and having negative responses would still score worse than a smaller store with all positive feedback.

BWA

Agreed, orders placed cann't be enough, I would leave room for ordering every item in my store (as seperate order 70K+), never fulfill any of them and still get a whopping score? Fulfillment has to be part in the equation...., (or presented as different gauges..., (orders placed, orders received (by buyers = received), feedback)

bsohn

Why not just not show the number until a perspective buyer enters the store, Then they can check the feedback at that point and decide whether or not they wish to purchase from them.. This would eliminate the scoring on basic pages but allow it to be viewed by the buyer. For the ones who say well this would encourage buyers to buy from bad stores you could have a step in the checkout process that asks the buyer if they wish to view this sellers feedback (and give the score) prior to placing your order with a yes or no checkbox.

MercifulGiraffe

As a fairly new user to the site, I would love to see the scoring (and possibly comments) be more obvious when ordering from a site. My very first purchase (which had 500+ items in it) was with a, shall we say "less than reputable" seller. A month later, goods not shipped, very vague communication from the seller and eventually a paypal refund. On a similar note, how do I remove this order from the list now? I cant seem to cancel it, and the seller certainly wont.

Timothy_Smith

^^^ but how does a feedback score for activity on another site impact that?
I've got 1500 points that have nothing at all to do with BrickOwl. There's a guy on another site with thousands of positives, and well over a hundred non-positives, but he gets orders all the time. (Starts with 'b'). If he transferred his score here it would be falsely optimistic.

Hellmouth's idea is along the lines of what I was thinking: any negative or positive feedback is shown to the buyer, sortable, etc. But adding that up to a total is avoided. There's no numeric score. And this is where the badges come in. A badge for 100 catalogue contributions may be worth as much as 100 feedbacks, or more, depending on the situation and the people involved.

Graham

My 2¢…

I feel the "score" is fine as well as the %, what definately needs improvement is getting folks to LEAVE feedback here (for me it's barely 1 in 4) at the moment it's not particularly easy to navigate to, a reminder system would be helpful as would an easier route to the leave feedback page.

With regards the "bump" (or boost) I feel that's OK too - it represents experience, however what should have also been included is the % of negs to positives.

- my boost came from eBay with 100% feedback and 5 star power seller status - I worked hard to get that i.e.. I resolved every problem (there were a few) to 100% satisfaction of the buyer. Not a single negative or neutral.

Like I said my 2¢

Graham

Timothy_Smith

Wouldn't it be *more* valuable to list those ebay specifics than to give a number?
Boosting feedback return rates seems like a lost cause. Maybe incentivize it somehow, but even then people aren't going to leave FB 100% of the time, and as has been said what does get left is skewed.

I just hate to see the same complaints about the same situation.
If nothing changes, nothing ever will change, y'know?

Graham

Another suggestion would be just remove the "boost" all here received, start again. Most have a good few f/b now, and everywhere else I have sold you start at 0 anyway.

I will guess it was to help/ease transition from (integration with) BL seamlessly in the beginning…

What thinkst you?

G

theHellmouth

What about removing the boosts from the feedback total but keep it on the user profile?

Timothy_Smith

I like the concept of a reputation boost, and it did make sense before this was the main Lego reselling site. I'm just trying to think of ways to get rid of people complaining about feedback numbers. On another site, 86% was a common fb rate, and people complained about the low numbers. With 18% being normalish here, I see a lot of anger and frustration in the future for sellers who care about such things. "It's unfair" will be the bitter refrain.

Graham

It's the % figure I find most important when making decisions on who to buy from, then if I find a seller with negs who has parts I want - I will read the negs - then decide.

example having 100 negs in 10,000 sales **looks** bad, but then they have 99% positive, typically I will steer away from sellers 95% and lower.

Now the problem I see with BrickOwl with the low rate of leaving feedback, is that a negative will have much more impact on a sellers reputation, 18% return is a little lower than I have calculated at 20%.

example Seller has 100 sales - 20% leave feedback, 1 is a neg. The rating will show 95%.
However if in fact the 80% that didn't leave feedback were "happy" the actual rating should be 99%

What would be nice is to see the number of sales, OR the % rating should be based on the total number of sales NOT total number of feedback.

@ the Hellmouth - that would be OK.
@ Timothy Smith - there will always be some who complain about "fair"…

and lastly I would really like to see the Amazon "style" of leaving feedback - you can't impulsively slam someone with a negative - you are required to have some communication with the seller to give them a chance to resolve any issues. Really I would like to see some form of intervention before a negative can be left.

Graham

catbricks

Buyer perspective here (although I have a few minifigs I should find and list, at some point): I think the current BrickOwl software could be a bit more assertive about asking me to leave feedback. A reminder email at 1-2 weeks post-transaction would not be unusual. I've had similar emails prompting me to review Amazon purchases, so I don't think the random non-AFOL buyer would be surprised to receive one or see if as major spam, as long as it were only one.

BWA

Hi All,

Good idea combining with badges..., implies boosts could/should be represented as cups (making up the experience trophy), and feedback on items on BO are just as they are, would leave a fair playing field if we all started at the same time with the same stock and procedures (etc)... therefore i think scoring feedback (in %) and then leaving it up to the buyer to further investigate sounds like a good idea..., math problem I see would be that achieving 100% would be very hard..., so maybe represent score as "harts/smiles etc.. in a row) (max 5 symbols, % filed based on positve -/- negative feedback compared to total feedbacks left)

Thor

If it is not broke, then don't "fix" it. The feedback system is fine as is. If people don't leave feedback, that is a DIFFERENT problem. If the problem is you are tired of people complaining, then disappear into the woods and become a hermit. Or simply stop reading what you don't like. People will ALWAYS complain about something. Or they will complain about the complainers.

Most of the complaints I read about feedback are from people who have not put in the years and thousands of hours of hard work necessary to build up triple-digit or four-digit feedback. Yes, I am very happy with my 8400+ feedback. I should be. I worked very hard for it these past 10 years. I should have more than 10,000 by now. But I am still quite happy with what I have. Because I EARNED it all.

If people are not leaving you feedback as often or as quickly as you like, then don't try to completely change the feedback system. Do what you can to encourage people to leave you more feedback or to make it easier for people to leave feedback. Or work harder to get more orders to build up your feedback more.

I strongly oppose any effort to fundamentally change the feedback system in mid-stream. If BrickOwl wants to use a fundamentally different feedback scoring system, it should have done so from the very beginning. But now there are many who have earned numerous feedbacks for orders they placed or received on BrickOwl the past six months. What will happen to that feedback if you now change the scoring system? How do you score or weigh feedback already earned?

I will end how I started. It ain't broke. So it doesn't need any "fixing".

Thor