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Thoughts on how to handle part variations
I've been cleaning up the catalog a bit and wanted to hear if there are any opinions on the following plan.
- Remove all "undetermined type" parts from the catalog, such as Tile 1 x 2 and only leave the version that specify the type such as "Tile 1 x 2 with groove"/"Tile 1 x 2 without groove".
- Shift all store lots/WishList lots from the undetermined type to whatever the more likely determined type version is and map the BL ID to that so when syncing it will sync to that item.
- Create relationships between variations of parts to link them up.
- On catalog pages on the buy tab, create a filter so customers can filter between stores that do differentiate part variations and those that don't.
- On stores, on items that have variations, if the store does not differentiate, a warning will be shown saying it could be part A or part B etc
I will probably need to allow stores to override their default part variation setting for specific items as some variations are more serious than others.
The biggest issue I see is people will look at "Tile 1 x 2 with groove" and then you have to explain some stores it won't actually have a groove, despite the name saying it will. I may have to come up with some trickery with regards to naming.
- Remove all "undetermined type" parts from the catalog, such as Tile 1 x 2 and only leave the version that specify the type such as "Tile 1 x 2 with groove"/"Tile 1 x 2 without groove".
- Shift all store lots/WishList lots from the undetermined type to whatever the more likely determined type version is and map the BL ID to that so when syncing it will sync to that item.
- Create relationships between variations of parts to link them up.
- On catalog pages on the buy tab, create a filter so customers can filter between stores that do differentiate part variations and those that don't.
- On stores, on items that have variations, if the store does not differentiate, a warning will be shown saying it could be part A or part B etc
I will probably need to allow stores to override their default part variation setting for specific items as some variations are more serious than others.
The biggest issue I see is people will look at "Tile 1 x 2 with groove" and then you have to explain some stores it won't actually have a groove, despite the name saying it will. I may have to come up with some trickery with regards to naming.
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Maybe this can work by creating parent parts that can't directly have inventory. For example with 4081, maybe you create p4081 as "parent" and attach a simple description of "Plate, Modified 1 x 1 with Clip Light" to it. Then relate child parts 4081, 4081a, and 4081b to it. Doing it this way would allow you to enable each seller to toggle on/off whether any one consolidate-variants-to-parent is used in their store (maybe come up with a "BrickOwl Standard" to make it easy for casual sellers).
That seems to solve the need to support sellers that want to do things differently.
For example, old windows 39, 39a, 39b need to be sorted properly by anyone selling them. This should not be an "optional variant" situation, since the market for these is specialized, and it is well worth it for any seller to take the time to sort them. And for a part like this, things like condition and usability of the part (some old CA parts will NOT fit anymore, and this needs to be noted in the listing) are much more difficult to detect than the extended lip on a window or whether the window has glass. Perhaps vintage entries like this need guidelines to pop up during the listing process to warn sellers of pitfalls.
By the way, please don't map 39 to 39a or 39b. In this case there really should be a 39c created because 39 is one of many umbrella entries on BL that informally stands for the later and most common variant of the part.
And I would be careful about mapping 39 to 39c, too, because people could have legitimately listed any of the variants under 39 on BL (even before some of the other variant entries were created). When someone syncs a lot like this with Brick Owl, ideally there would be some form of notification or request to confirm the variants in their stock. Otherwise Brick Owl will inherit a lot of problem listings from BL right from the beginning.
I know this sounds overly complicated and fussy, but as a buyer I have spent countless hours weeding through old listings, contacting sellers, etc. Sometimes I think it would be easier just to have sellers relist vintage stock after X number of years for sections of the catalog that have undergone substantial change.
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Regarding the tile 1 x 2, even though this is a different situation because the part is still being produced, the timeframe for the early variant is so far passed that practically speaking, any store that officially claims to not distinguish part variations is not going to be handling the older type.
This is like worrying if some of the old CA 3001old bricks might turn up under the 3001 listing (which technically on BL they could). Any seller who is concerned about quality control needs to know their sources and filter the stuff that is really old before blindly adding to their lots for sale.
So in the case of the tile 1 x 2, I would proceed as you have outlined above, only hold off on the name trickery unless it really becomes an issue. I can actually see you having more problems with folks cosmetically not wanting to see the extra words "with groove" in their store listings than concerns over customers getting the wrong part.
Now in the case of 4081 (etc), this is trickier because the "end date" of the early variant is not as far removed, hence more likelihood of buyer issues. But with the filters and warnings you are planning to implement, I think you are safe to proceed.
Anyway, a very good plan, and I'm pleased to see this issue being dealt with so thoroughly and with such fresh, new ideas.
I also had a MOC where it was very important to receive the older grille tiles WITHOUT groove. Some sellers had this figured out, others didn't. I eventually got everything I needed but not very simply.
Then again I'm not an Amazon mom, I'm a hard-core AFOL...
Brian
Edit: I just noticed that I can't find a thin-ring 4081 here anymore. Bummer...
I have started to add data about the relations between parts. If you sell a cone and you don't differentiate, you will see a warning on that item that the bottom in your store.
I've also stripped all the ID numbers from the undetermined types, but I'm not sure my plan of shifting them to the determined versions as there are many people selling the undetermined versions, but in their store they state that they differentiate parts, so this would be a big mess. I may simply hide them from the catalog instead.
At this point in time we wont be forcing stores to decide between certain variations.
TLG don't have ####a, b & c etc - but completely different part #'s
BrickLink's system is aggravating in that it isn't logical at all!
Some variants start with route # then a, b & c some are just a,b & c WITHOUT a route #, some don't have an "a" but do have a "b"
Thin / thick ring does show in a model but what about hollow stud/solid stud/completely open stud?
Granted "open stud" would allow wires/tubes to pass thru - but other than that??
I like what DadsAFoL do on B/L show the variants/substitutes on a separate page.
Variants are often not caught by the person who does the original inventory of a set - (too much of a mad rush to get the brownie points!)
Sometimes MUCH later found and a change request put in, by that time many many sets have been added to inventories incorrectly.
I choose to state (here) that I don't differentiate - however I do actually keep parts separate when found...
(I also second DadsAFoL suggestion above)
my tuppence worth - Graham
Regarding the BL item numbers - I continue to marvel at the number of experienced sellers and buyers who do not fully understand this system. Not because I think they *should* understand it, but that there are so many who don't and yet successful buying and selling carries on anyway.
For the record, this is how it works - if a BL item number for a part is simply the bare Lego ID (usually 4 or 5 numerical digits), then that is an undetermined entry, e.g. 3001 (2 x 4 brick). Strictly speaking, a seller can use that entry for any or all of the 18+ variations of that brick, including the ubiquitous 3001old, which pretty much stands for every variation prior to about 1980. 3001old could also be named 3001a in BL nomenclature, but it isn't.
One important exception to this pattern is when a new variant comes out with a new TLG number. In that case, the "bare" part number IS a specific variation, and there will be no "a, b, c, d" used. See the macaroni brick entries 3063 and 85080.
Any item number with a "letter" suffix (a, b, c, d) refers to a specific variant and this specification is also reflected in the item name. Often the variant entries for a given part are incomplete, so there is an "a" but no "b", or vice versa. Sometimes the undetermined entry (i.e. the one without the "a, b, c, d") is deleted/merged because the site insists that due to the importance of the variation, all sellers must sort that particular part into its variants.
Reasons for not allowing an undetermined entry include: 1) the variants are functionally different, i.e. they are not interchangeable when building (e.g. webbed radar dish 4285), and 2) the variants have a major cosmetic difference which would preclude them, for example, from being used side by side in a model (e.g. round bricks 1 x 1).
Since the gravity of these reasons is subjective, there is plenty of quibbling to be done (on a part-by-part basis) over whether it is worth sellers' time sorting out the variants. And due to the fact that decisions on such parts are forced by the system (via marking the undetermined entry for deletion, thereby prohibiting sellers from using it for new listings) there has been a strong negative reaction against catalog specificity in general, even in cases where an undetermined entry is provided. Many people don't realize that, for example, the infamous "headlight brick 1 x 1 with slot" entry never forced anyone to sort out the ones that didn't have a slot.
SO, the result is a system where there are both specific entries and overlapping entries, but not a complete set of each; and to go along with that, plenty of people who don't understand this, and also a strong division between "collectors" and "builders" (for lack of better terms - nobody I know, including myself, fits neatly in either of those categories).
Of course, this does not have to be the case on Brick Owl. And the part about wrong variants creeping into inventories - that doesn't have to happen on Brick Owl either. There could be tools developed to prompt inventory workers to make the correct decisions, and there could be stricter control over what gets approved.
And I will state about myself (as a buyer) that I am very fussy about certain variations, but I do not expect others to share my same level of enthusiasm about such matters (unless, of course, they claim to in their listings). Also, I buy both from stores that specify variations and those that don't. Sometimes the variant matters to me, but sometimes I would rather have new pieces in the right quantity and at the right price.