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New Catalog Contribution Category

LoremongerLoremonger
edited August 2014 in Catalog Discussions Vote Up0Vote Down
I love the look of item images with removed backgrounds. So I find myself submitting images for items that already have perfectly good photos in the catalog, except the existing images do not have the backgrounds removed. Honestly, some of the photos I'm taking aren't as good as the existing ones, but they take the place of the other photos because I took the time to remove the background.

How about a new contribution category for removing the background of existing catalog images? I know that doctoring someone else's photos might be a touchy issue. But really, why should I take the time to get out the part and take an (honestly) inferior photo, when I could just cut out the background of the good photo that's already there?

If you decide to implement this, you might consider also making a two-teir points system for images: a lower tier for images with backgrounds, and a higher tier for images with backgrounds removed.

Enoch

Comments

  • 22 Comments sorted by Votes Date Added
  • robernatrobernat
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    How exactly do you remove backgrounds? I came across a website not so long ago, but it was feebased or something like that if I recall well. Any good freeware out there?
  • StragusStragus
    edited August 2014 Vote Up0Vote Down
    You can do it in Gimp and it's open-source, but it's quite a few steps, and you need to know what you are doing.

    I wouldn't mind removing backgrounds. Though, I had tried before submitting this image :
    http://img.brickowl.com/files/image_cache/larger/lego-transparent-windscreen-12-x-6-x-6-curved-without-pin-holes-94531-25-973457-97.jpg
    And I think we should agree not to remove the background for Trans-Clear parts, it looks... rather weird :), since the background is also visible through the part.
  • LoremongerLoremonger
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    I still like it better this way.

    I use Gimp. With high contrast, the fuzzy select works fine. For stuff like this, you have to use the lasso. This took me three minutes.
  • StragusStragus
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    Hum, yes.

    I thought it looked weird when I did it, but you are right: it's probably preferable to get a homogeneous look for all parts, even transparent ones.
  • robernatrobernat
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    I took a quick shot at Gimp, the result wasn't great, so I guess I need to study the options a bit more, must say it was on a very low resolution image. The biggest problem I had was when I saved the image: it became a .xcf file, is there a way to save as .jpg?
  • StragusStragus
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    File->Export

    Starting from Gimp 2.8, the "Save" function only saves as XCF and everything else is an export. Meh.
  • robernatrobernat
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    Ah, ok, I'll give it a try again then :-)
    I hope it doesn't take much more then a min or 5, otherwise it will be extra charge of time when submitting images...
  • StragusStragus
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    Make sure to enable "Single Window Mode" (menu bar->Windows->...).

    Having everything in separate windows (the default for the past 15 years) is only convenient on Unix with certain window managers, you probably don't want that on Windows or OSX.
  • robernatrobernat
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    Ok, first try on a higher resolution picture, I need to be a bit more precise when cutting it seems. How about the result?
  • StragusStragus
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    Perhaps you need practice. :)

    The selection edge should preferably be smooth to avoid such sharp edges. An "easy" solution would be to approximatively select the background, shrink the selection by 1-2 pixels, create a mask layer from the selection (which is 2-3 steps process), smooth the whole mask layer, multiply color and mask layer, merge layers and save the result.

    Gimp is fairly powerful but it's a time investment to learn (which I would recommend to anyone).
  • LoremongerLoremonger
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    @RobErNat It really just takes some practice. My normal process is this:

    Crop
    Adjust color levels. Colors > Levels > Select White.
    Fuzzy select the background. You can hold the button down and slide it to the right or left to adjust the threshold on the fly. Use add mode to make multiple selections.
    Clean up the edges with the lasso tool. Use add mode to select more of the background. Use subtract mode to clear any of the mask that bled into the object.
    Delete the background.
    Export.

    Tada!

    Using a light tent with a few lamps on it to eliminate shadows helps tremendously. For pictures like this one, you should be able to just use the fuzzy select tool.
  • StragusStragus
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    The edges won't be as smooth as the technique outlined above, but it's certainly good enough :), especially if working on a high-resolution photo (12 megapixels or whatever) before scaling it down for BrickOwl.

    For images already in a low resolution, I would still recommend using a multiply layer and smoothing the selection edge...
  • robernatrobernat
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    @Loremonger:
    A light tent is on my 'to do' list next few weeks, must say when I have decent lightning, pictures are usually good enough to just use white balancing and contrast which I usually do with Microsoft D.I.
    http://www.brickowl.com/catalog/lego-train-door-1-x-4-x-5-right-with-red-blue-stripe-4182
    Lightning on this one wasn't perfect, but quite good, so the result is quite fair. With a light tent the shadows could be avoided and give better results, with a fully white background that isn't influenced by surrounding colors. It might even been good enough without using Gimp.
    Can you upload the image you treated on BO, it's BOID 935005, your final image is better, so one less to do :D
  • LoremongerLoremonger
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    Perhaps you need practice. :)

    The selection edge should preferably be smooth to avoid such sharp edges. An "easy" solution would be to approximatively select the background, shrink the selection by 1-2 pixels, create a mask layer from the selection (which is 2-3 steps process), smooth the whole mask layer, multiply color and mask layer, merge layers and save the result.
    I'm trying this method. I have successfully created the mask layer. What do you mean by smooth the whole mask layer? Also, how do I multiply color and mask layer?
  • LoremongerLoremonger
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    @RobErNat Uploaded.
  • StragusStragus
    Vote Up0Vote Down

    I'm trying this method. I have successfully created the mask layer. What do you mean by smooth the whole mask layer? Also, how do I multiply color and mask layer?
    By smoothing, I meant just applying a light blur on that layer, in order to smooth the edges a little (that layer must be selected or it will blur the base one). "Multiply" is one of the many layer modes.

    You could also just Image -> Decompose and smooth an alpha channel created from a selection, then recompose from the channels.
  • robernatrobernat
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    @Loremonger: thanks, and already approved by Admin, so looking great in the database :)
    How about this: depending on your occupations offcourse (I lack time): I send you pictures, you 'treat' them, you send 35% back to me so I can upload and get credits for them, and you can upload the other 65% and get credit for it. Would save me a lot of time for other contributions like weights and sizes. I have so much older stuff that could serve the database 'picturewise', but at current pace (and not perfect images either) it's gonna take me years to get them uploaded ~X(
  • StragusStragus
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    :) Nice. Let me know if you two need an extra hand (or two hands, it's easier to type) to process images!
  • LoremongerLoremonger
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    @RobErNat Sounds like a plan. I can share a OneDrive folder with you that we can work out of. I'll PM you so we can exchange email addresses.
  • LawrenceLawrence
    Vote Up0Vote Down
    :) that's nice to see the community working together like that. I'm a fan of background removed images but I'm aware it's a lot of work, a compromise is very tightly cropped images on as white a background as you can.
  • robernatrobernat
    edited August 2014 Vote Up0Vote Down
    We'll set it up (I have a google drive available as well), Loremonger and Stragus, both welcome to process my images. However not in the next few weeks, my complete LEGO-room has been packed :(( , workers starts on monday as my entire roof will be redone. Still need to pack all my original boxes (4m²) as they are in a small, high risk attick (if the workers step throught the inner finishing it will be a disaster), so besides what I have in my inventory, I can't produce many images (and still need to make a light tent as well). And on top I need to do part of the demolition (chimneys and such), and construct an uplift of part of the roof (a bit like the image below, but then with an inclined roof, not a flat roof) so I can make a bathroom for my son (next year). So work in progress, not much time for LEGO (still need to run my orders, as I'm keeping my BO store open).

    Lawrence, not to worry, a small community working together can achieve a lot, and from the looks of it (with al the recent events on BL) it might just grow a little more and faster. I closed my BL-shop, and I'm seriously considering to never open it again as I'm really fed up with all the waist of resources, so most likely I'll be concentrating 100% on Brickowl, both as a seller and as contributor (not having to adjust my inventories all the time will save a lot of time). So expect a serious boost on data in near future :)
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