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Please consider retrospectively revising Feedback Boost
My personal view on the feedback boost is that although it is a good idea it should have been capped at a low but sufficiently high enough number to provide buyer confidence but not introduce such a large distortion; that is the very large 'feedback gap' between those who received the largest boosts and those at the bottom.
In other words, a +100 feedback sufficiently shows that you are trustworthy seller but if you have a +5000 feedback thanks to 10 years on BL or EB then it can only provide an unfair advantage on BO over those stores starting with a significantly lower feedback.
Who are we trying to reward here? The customer with better informed choices or stores that were established on other marketplaces many years ago?
Would you buy from a store with 0 feedback when you see another with the same item, maybe a tad more expensive, but no doubt safer as it has a +5000 feedback? We might choose the 0 feedback store because we know how this 'store boost' was implemented but we of course are primarily sellers and not buyers.
I understand that Admin may want to give new buyers the impression that 10,000s of sales have occurred on BO through transferring of feedback from other marketplaces. Although I can see the logic with this move I think it should be reviewed (and hopefully retrospectively 'corrected') in the short-to-medium term.
I am quite happy with the work being done by Admin and the nature and format of providing incremental improvements as time goes by. It is after-all a learning curve for all.
As a side note, having a low boost cap that by definition is standard enables all to make proper comparisons at how well stores are doing on BO and introduces some credibility and meaningfulness to the BO numbers shown.
In other words, a +100 feedback sufficiently shows that you are trustworthy seller but if you have a +5000 feedback thanks to 10 years on BL or EB then it can only provide an unfair advantage on BO over those stores starting with a significantly lower feedback.
Who are we trying to reward here? The customer with better informed choices or stores that were established on other marketplaces many years ago?
Would you buy from a store with 0 feedback when you see another with the same item, maybe a tad more expensive, but no doubt safer as it has a +5000 feedback? We might choose the 0 feedback store because we know how this 'store boost' was implemented but we of course are primarily sellers and not buyers.
I understand that Admin may want to give new buyers the impression that 10,000s of sales have occurred on BO through transferring of feedback from other marketplaces. Although I can see the logic with this move I think it should be reviewed (and hopefully retrospectively 'corrected') in the short-to-medium term.
I am quite happy with the work being done by Admin and the nature and format of providing incremental improvements as time goes by. It is after-all a learning curve for all.
As a side note, having a low boost cap that by definition is standard enables all to make proper comparisons at how well stores are doing on BO and introduces some credibility and meaningfulness to the BO numbers shown.
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As for the cap, I think diminishing returns would have worked well. Let's say, a boost equal to the square root of the external feedback (or, less harshly, x^0.7 or so).
But remember in the mean while: good prices and decent inventory will give you the orders to build FB
I like the idea about the about removing the boost at some point in time. RobErNat, I'm not sure if you were meaning to remove all boosts after BO has been up for two years OR that an individual's boost be removed after two years on BO. I would suggest a Solomon-like approach of giving the boost (for two years or so), but displaying a symbol next to the FB that indicates the boost. (Maybe this could be shown with an * which is used in some record books to show that the accomplishment is not exactly like that of others in the list.) A successful seller might well choose to forgo the boost, especially after the initial assistance, to remove the 'assisted' tag. Once I build a decent FB number on BO, I would certainly rather be judged on that alone rather than the boost.
And I did mean the removal of boosts for **all** people after 2 years, but that last thing is something to be considered by Admin.
Then the instant checkout gets rid of the doubts elsewhere (i.e. all the hidden fees), the only things from a buyers perspective will be "did I get what I paid for in a timely manor" and the absence of feedback left by the customer is actually a sign that they were "satisfied"
I don't mind either way however if someone is looking at your feedback they can see the "boost" clearly.
The advantage here goes to sellers with large number of lots and reasonable prices - NOT popularity OR feedback # - I think it would be better to remove (or re-name) the "popular stores" list rather than worry about the FB boost personally.
A more important measure of a good seller is % positive (like eBay)
Graham
And feedback IS relevant, maybe not for some buyers, but I have lived a progressive growth the past 5 years on BL and it is clear to me FB **does** play a role, the more you have, the easier orders roll in, even if prices are a little higher. At every extra few hundred FB's, I felt it was simply easier to sell things and get more orders without even list that much more. Proof is that the past 8 or 9 months I hardly added 20.000 parts, yet I have sold over 35.000 (BO/BL combined), so my shop is drying out (from my point of view), yet orders kept rolling in (except this week maybe LOL). FB contributes to 'buyers feeling confident', imagine all shops would have started at FB 0 here, BO would have had a difficult start IMHO.
With stock of under 10000 I only had a couple of sales in 2013, things picked up in January (10 orders) so I kept adding and investing.
Now in May with 50000+ stock and feedback of just over 100 I've made it into the Popular stores list. I didn't think I'd come close to making that list in my first year!
I'm now wondering how important feedback really is?
There's 3 or 4 stores in the Popular list with feedback under 500
I started at zero on BrickOwl (and it's too late to ask for a boost since I already have BO feedback), and orders are markedly smaller than expected. People are cautious with low feedback. I have had several orders in the 3 digits on a different marketplace, not a single one on BrickOwl.
Maybe not, because if all sellers would have started on zero, maybe the site woudn't have taken off the way it did now. Because buyers might have taken the wrong descisions and buy from the wrong seller and be scared way.
What buyers 'needed' was confidence in the site, the sellers who started out here 'early' (with FB boosts) helped to do that by having their 'past' experiance visualised to potential buyers. I truly believe without that, the site would have had a much harder start. Once the confidence was there for the buyers, it's obvious it is less problematic to buy from a low feedbacker, because in the mean while, they trust 'the site', but that trust has been build by the sellers, with the experiance and showing so by FB numbers...
Best proof is that things picked up for you in january, 6 months after the start of this website, because in those six months fresh buyers have explored this site and got their confidence build up, so yes, a seller with good intentions like yourself grew a little in those early months, but now is 'rocking' because you proved yourself in the mean while...
And that is exactly the point of that FB boost Admin implemented in the first place... It opened paths to be walked on by others, a path opened by some established sellers
I'm glad you're doing well, and a few other newer shops as well, as it only confirms this site is growing and this will bring new buyers to the site and generate more orders for all shops around, so we all need to be happy about that.
But make no mistake, FB wil always be looked at by a number of buyers, the more you have the easier it will go for you. Mark my words and remember them when you have reached 500 FB's, it makes a huge difference ;-)
I concur with what others have said before: it's only partially the feedback number that gets you orders. The most important thing is a wide variety of bricks, a sufficient number of bricks, good prices but most importantly: good service, customer communication and prompt handling/shipping.
So I'm quite confident this change in my feedback number won't affect my future orders.
@Lawrence
Please remove my 'boost' feedbacks, thanks in advance !
Those are the rules, once you get a first feedback, boost is no longer possible...
Personally I think it's no longer needed to have boosts btw, the site has been running for nearly 2 years now, a lot of sellers with 'boosts' did a good job to build confidence to buyers, and those same sellers have build up nice FB scores in the mean while...And the site has also proven what's it worthed at the same time.
So if you do a good job, then there is no reason to have a boosts at this point. In regards to sellers who had boosts in the past, I think anyone should put in a goal or a target and have the boost removed once the target is reached, and as stated earlier in this thread, a full removal of all boosts should be considered by Admin in the long run (IMHO) to have all sellers play at the same level. But that is his decision and at his discretion, just in the same way as it his discretion to have set the rules regarding FB boosts in the first place ;-)
Cora Creations feedback boost was afaik not the 'BL' score, but the 'Ebay' score (if I remember well)
My boost was my Ebay score as well (well, 1 of 2 Ebay accounts actually, the other one has more): 500, while on BL I had about 1800, I saw no need whatsoever to 'import' 1800 FB's, 500 was just fine to get started :P
FB boost where always 'rounded' to the 'hundred' lower FB, so 320 or 365 or 398 are always rounded towards 300.
The rule that says it's too late for the boost once you have received your first BrickOwl feedback doesn't make much sense to me either... I have also been caught by this.
I'm not against the concept of recognizing external feedback, but it really shouldn't be worth as much as true BrickOwl feedback. It's also problematic because only about 30% of BrickOwl customers leave feedback.
Do you really think it makes a difference whether you had a boost or not?
You say 30% leave feedback, so you had roughly 460 orders so far? I wouldn't call that bad, particulary since you opened your store here about 1 year ago. As far as I can tell, that's better then you did on BL during that same period, so is the 'non' import of FB 'hurting' you, I don't think so ;-)
If buyers 'lack' giving feedback, then it most likely means they don't care for it, so why would they care about you only having 138 feedbacks and another one having 6800 FB's when placing their order ?
They just want the LEGO they are looking for...
And the 70% who are not leaving FB: well, as long as they don't contact you for an issue, or don't give you a neutral or negative, they have to be considered 'happy buyers' just as well, together with the 30% that does leave FB ;-)
Personally, I don't think the feedback score matters much once it's above 100. But having to start from zero just because one forgot to claim a boost before testing the marketplace (like, placing an order) is a strange rule.
Hundreds of sellers started with FB Zero on other marketplaces and they managed to grow their store regardless of it.
Briwkowl, 'as a site' would have had a tougher start if we all started with FB 0, so the import of FB's was a good move to build buyers confidence. Now the site has thousands of buyers and sellers who builded up FB on BO and so now the confidence in both site and sellers is good enough to actually consider to simply stop boosts and/or remove them for all people (IMO).
The downside of boosts is that any seller with an accumulated amount of many neutrals and negatives on other marketplaces, but who's total amount of FB is largely positive, get a start clean start on BO, if *only* their Positives are imported, then BO would actually 'mask' the reality, and from a buyers perspective that wouldn't be fair at all... and far worse then having to start at 0 right now IMHO.
Remember the Ckolodny case, over a hundred neutrals and negatives on BL, but his overal FB score was still around 300 positives, imagine he would have been allowed to only import his positives here on BO. The result would have been catastrophic for buyers here.
I'd like to define that statement (sorry).
The boost is just a number, a rounded number, therefor it skips off negatives and neutrals.
As far as I know it doesn't influence the % a seller has (or does it?)
And the 'imported' FB 'statement's are not displayed either.
Unless you can point out to a seller who has a non 100% positive feedback, but who got 100% positives on BO so far.
e.g. Seller johnsma (and it's really a random example, I could have picked any) did have neutrals and negatives yet 2600 FB's where imported:
johnsma2000 has received a feedback boost of 2,600 based on their feedback performance on other marketplaces.
It does not say: of which 3 where neutral and 4 where negative (and those 7 where from prior to the start of BO)
The percentage here on BO for that seller is a well deserved 100%, but among those 2600 imported FB's there where neutrals and negatives, the total was more then 2600 when the import took place, but some of the neutrals and negatives where received during the build up of those 2600 FB's, so those have not been in taken in consideration in any way or displayed in any way, so from my point of view only 'positives' where taken in consideration to do boosts.
I'm sure I can find another few dozen examples like that, so prove me wrong on the contrary by pointing out to a seller who's boosts are displaying 'less' favorable allthough he/she would have a perfect BO record.
At your descretion I'm sure you would refuse to import a FB score if the seller has too many negatives or neutrals, that is your perogative offcourse, but from my point of view, boosts, *if* imported do not include neutrals or negatives, as it's just a rounded number, without any background (not even the site it came from).
Eric
feedback: xxx (100%)
orders: yyy
average shipping time: d days
I don't think it is possible to have an average shipping time displayed since many customers request orders be held open so they can add to an existing order (Skews the ship time) I think this was a topic sometime back and Lawrence said it had too many variables.
Let's assume that everyone who has a negative experience will leave a negative FB. There are reasons this is a good assumption, but I'll try to stay on topic.
People (or at least me) look for negative FB. That number of negative FB needs to be normalized to draw a meaningful conclusion. So I can compare to a firm number, like total orders processed, or to a fuzzy number, like number of orders processed for which customers chose to leave FB.
Back on topic; with such a low percentage of customers leaving feedback, all sellers and the whole marketplace appear far less active than they actually are. That's bad for many reasons, for customers and new potential sellers. Just showing the raw count of orders somewhere would make a difference.
I already forgot about your order, has been shipped ages ago :P
Thanks for reviewing the boosts system, in the long run it will give a better reflection on how sellers are doing and it will level more between the 'very active' sellers here who actually are building up their score here and a few less active sellers who have way more FB's because they where 'imported'.
Does the change you made started it's count on april 13th 2015 for all sellers? Does this mean that on april 13th 2016 all sellers who started earlier on on BO will have their boost removed? Just asking as I still see many of the earlier stores carrying their boost.
@polarbomber
@khle
Personally I consider 'number of orders' received 'personal' information and I'm therefor entirely opposed to displaying such. It is of no-ones business to know how many orders a seller has received of the course of years (and besides, a system like that would allow anyone to start making statistics on the total amount of orders are being processed on the site as a whole).
True, the number of FB's received from buyers might be on the low end, but it's like that (apparently) for all sellers, so why worry about it? All sellers are playing on the same grounds, so quite fair... The site has been running only for less then 2 years, so it's only natural sellers only have FB's in the hundreds, in the long run, 5 or 10 years from now, some will be in the thousands, it's a natural flow. And maybe by then the buyers will be more familiar with the FB system and so numbers received might even rise more.