Another Shipping Settings Question

Thor

I am trying to input weight bands and prices for domestic US first class shipping. The first 13 ounces is easy because USPS postage rates are all the same throughout the country. However, above 13 ounces, postage rates vary by distance. For example, from the US East Coast, domestic first class postage for a two pound parcel ranges from $5.80 to $9.80.

Does the automatic shipping calculator on BO take into account this range for US shipping? Or do I have to manually input a fixed price that is the same for all US buyers regardless of distance or actual postage? If the later, how do other US sellers handle this? Did you input the higher price in the range or some mid-point or average? And how have or will you handle those not-so-distant buyers if they complain that shipping is a buck or two or three more than actual postage?

Again, maybe I am just too hung up on how I do things on BL and making my shipping be as close to actual postage as possible.

Thor

bigdh

I have to say that I am finding the Shipping Options section confusing, but that could be just me.

I am not sure I like the idea that the system will calculate the shipping costs based on what is bought and my general settings (If I understand it correctly).

This is one thing I like better on Brick Link. I pull parts, find a box that fits best, weigh the order and then I calculate the shipping costs. Sometimes it even turns out better for the buyer to ship in 2 packages (tiny part & a baseplate for example).

I would prefer to just have the buyer be able to select the type of shipping (First Class, Priority, etc.) and then I calculate the cost.

DadsAfol

I'm sure this will be a lively debate here due to the habits BL created in sellers. @bigdh, this is an eCommerce site for casual buyers who are used to Amazon and other sites. You will need to figure this out in advance. It's not BL.

@Thor, I think BO can do more to help US sellers deal with "zone" calculation to bring it closer to exact shipping. For now, I put a comment in my Priority Mail shipping method that we would refund any excess postage. I loaded that shipping method with my zone 8 pricing. I hope that gets prioritized on the to-do list.

Sir Troys

I was just about to post this same question. The pricing for different zones can vary greatly, so this will need to be addressed. Also, the size restrictions for dimensional weight vary by zone as well. It will get very complicated.

That said, I do believe that it is worth the effort, as the BL method of doing thing is confusing to buyers. Taking payment immediately also eliminates most NPB issues.

Lawrence

Hey,

I entered some of the shipping rates from the USPS website myself but clearly I underestimated the complexity of it. Am I correct in understanding there are different prices for different areas of the USA? Are these price differences large, or in the region of a dollar or two?

We want to strike a balance between value for money on the shipping and the complexity of trying to calculate the absolute amount. The main thing is that the buyer sees exactly how much the shipping will cost upfront.

DagsBricks

Ebay integrates the USPS API which I think would solve most issues. It is a weight-distance pricing matrix. A 4k package can cost $30 going coast to coast or $10 to go next door. Bit of a difference I'd say.

That doesn't include the flat rate boxes though, those have their own pricing structure, sometimes better sometimes not.

Brian

Sir Troys

Unfortunately there are EIGHT zones for Priority Mail in the US, and which zone an address falls into depends on the origination address as well as the destination address. Shipping from my address in Ohio, California would be in Zone 8. But shipping from an address in Nevada it may be only Zone 3.

To do it accurately you would need to allow for 8 zones, and for some way for the seller specify which zip codes fall into which zone, as this will be different for every seller (The zone charts can be downloaded from the USPS website).

I am not sure, but it is likely that the USPS has an API that you can use to calculate the shipping on the fly. You way want to look in to that. Then a seller could just specify what weight to add for packaging, what handling charge they have, and the system could calculate the shipping from there.

USPS also has numerous zones for international shipping as well. I think 4 for First Class and 9 for Priority Mail!

Lawrence

Well that sounds rather more complex than I had realised. I can certainly integrate with their API, I guess you would then also want to modify the prices and adjust the weight bands for packaging etc. I guess I will need to put more thought into the matter.

DagsBricks

Furthermore Paypal requires tracking or registered mail for a package to qualify for seller protection. I'd like to trigger these on orders of a certain value or higher. Same for insurance.

Brian

bigdh

and not all of us use Pay Pal shipping. We use Endicia, and I know there are other services too.

Lar

How do I just calculate shipping after the fact?

I DON'T have time to set up complicated shipping schemes. My customer base is worldwide, and high value (I'm not a parts seller except for a few items) and I sell one copy of a set and that's it, often.

I'm OK with losing the business that comes from having pay at once.

DadsAfol

@Lar, that's not how this site works. There have been some suggestions to make it more exact, but the best suggestion for now is to just set your weight/price bands at the high end of the range, and refund your buyers for any excess postage.

Lar

Meh. Looking like unless that is offered as an option I won't be switching.

Shipping is incredibly complex to set up here. is there some thought of offering canned pre-setup "bands" that one can just start with instead of forcing every seller to start from scratch?

It is just not worth the time to me to do this, every single order I get at BL has different shipping.

Lawrence

On the shipping method add screen, there are some prefilled ones that you can use, you can then adjust the prices upwards to meet your needs

Thor

Admin, I think a nice compromise would be to allow sellers to give buyers an OPTION to either pay now or to pay later after the seller has determined shipping and packaging. Let the seller and buyer decide. Most casual or one-time buyers will opt for the convenience of immediate payment based on fixed shipping rates even if those shipping rates are higher than actual postage. However, more experienced buyers like myself may occasionally prefer to be billed later because we know that experienced trustworthy sellers will make more of an effort to charge actual postage.

Let me give you just one example. Yesterday I posted about the different US postage rates for domestic first class shipping that vary not only based on weight but by distance too. Thus, for example, a two pound parcel shipped via domestic first class in the US will have postage costing anywhere from $5.80 to $9.80 depending on the distance between the seller and buyer. Your suggestion for dealing with this range was for sellers to input the higher price in their shipping calculations. Well, this just means that US buyers who are located close to each other will pay a lot more for shipping. As an experienced buyer, I would like the option of paying later if I order from a seller located in or near my state, rather than him charging me fixed shipping that errs on the high side.

I worry that using fixed up-front shipping that errs on the high side will result in buyers (including me) paying substantially more for shipping. As such, I am more likely to use BL to order from a seller who lives fairly close to me. Which means BO loses the sale and fees from that sale. As a seller, I also worry about the inevitable complaints, disputes and negative feedback from buyers who discover they were charged significantly more than actual postage under the BO system. Sure, sellers can always refund overpaid shipping. But that is awkward and time consuming and not very convenient or professional. And sellers who do routinely refund for shipping overages calculated under the BO system will likely lose out on shipping overall because they cannot ask buyers who are undercharged shipping to pay more.

I know the BO system is not meant to be exact and I do like it as one choice. But, I think I and many other sellers and buyers would also like the option and choice of being invoiced later with more precise shipping. Keep the BO pay as you go system. But supplement it with an option for Bill Me Later that may be more attractive to more experienced knowledgeable active buyers. An option given to us more experienced buyers only if the seller chooses to offer us that option.

Thor

Lawrence

It's definitely something I will consider, somewhere in between "request a shipping quote" and " submit your order and hope it doesn't cost too much". This will be particularly necessary if a seller has no shipping rates available for a certain item/destination so the buyer can easily contact the seller and ask them if they will ship.

Ideally I want something where you can say what the shipping amount is for their cart, and then you can manually override the shipping amount for that specific cart and they can then continue with the checkout.

Lar

I'm not sure that's exactly what Thor was asking for. But if I understand him, it's what I would like to see too rather than what you said.

I did not like the BL approach of ONLY allowing post sale shipping calculations, although it worked for me, it hurt others.

I don't like the BO approach of NEVER allowing post sale shipping either. But in this case it's a showstopper for me. Unless you tie into the USPS site for all shipping calculations I cannot see how I possibly could set up shipping bands that work for me in a reasonable amount of time.

Lawrence

My phrasing was bad but I think I have something that will work. I will get working on it now.

Jay

Australia is even worse. We have 16 postal zones. Up to 500g is a flat rate regardless of distance. They do have some flat rate satchels & boxes but anything over 500g that won't fit into them attracts a basic charge of $8.95 same state and $11.45 interstate + a distance charge, which from my zone ranges from 90c to $5.20 per kg.

They charge by cubic/volumetric weight for anything weighing over 1kg, unless the delivery PO is within 50km of the destination PO, meaning that a large item I can post locally for $8.95 could easily cost $50 or more to send to Tassie, Western Australia or Northern Territory.

Lar

Jay: Postal services DO love their complex pricing schemes, don't they?

Admin: That sounds great! And let me apologise if I've come off as a bit strident! ...For every seller like me that has very complex requirements there probably are a dozen or more who really like the idea of being able to get paid at the time of the order... no more NPB, no more multiple invoices without any news, no more reserving inventory for weeks waiting to see if the buyer pays or not, and so forth. Heck, if you come up with a fully automated scheme I may be tempted to switch.

Now that you said you're working on it, well... maybe you ought to work your priority list , my desires may not be nearly as high priority as some of the other shipping related stuff. I'm just noisy.

Jay

....and this is our new simplified postal system that came into effect in April

We also have a large letter rate for items under 20mm that weigh under 500g. It ranges from $1.20 to $3.00 but anything over 20mm thick has to be sent as a parcel and minimum cost for that is $6.95.

walstib

So Canada has zones too. Big surprise. I could be wrong and it is distance along the postal route instead but one way or another one size does not fit all.

If our provinces and territories were added to the destination drop down menu somehow, or there was a sub menu for regions in the country, I could get custom shipping methods a lot closer to real price than I can now with domestic parcels.

I don't know how clear that is or how much work to do, seems like one option to me.